Comments on Childfree Clique: More of My Pro-Choice Rantings

What I don't understand is.. What the hell are...

2011-12-04T10:24:13.535-07:00

What I don't understand is.. What the hell are all these anti choicers basing their thoughts on? If a woman in Pennsylvania has an abortion, my life will be no worse off than I was before. It seems that they honestly just cant STAND not having someone poor to jeer at. Anti choice policies honestly disgust me to no end. They won't let us have contraception, they won't educate us, and all happiness in the world be DAMNED if someone does NOT birth something. I am a christian, and there is no basis AT ALL that they can cling to in the book. If god causes millions of miscarriages a day, and he doesn't sin like THEY keep saying, then abortions aren't sins either. Because a miscarriage is called a spontaneous ABORTION for a reason. The god they claim to be "pro life" has probably aborted thousands of children by the time I'm finished with this post. Seriously, it pisses me off how they make ALL (not just some) christians look like ignorant, right wing, jackasses. Seriously, why can't they just get with the program?..... Oh yeah.. They refuse to.

Chioldfree Chick - You could do the video anonymou...

2009-12-22T00:52:14.872-07:00

Chioldfree Chick - You could do the video anonymously. Lots of my friends make YouTube videos and they either talk but don't show their faces, or they make a video with text and music.

Gypsy Witch- That is genius and I'm lov...

2009-12-21T11:53:47.741-07:00

Gypsy Witch- That is genius and I'm loving the idea...just wish I didn't have to be anonymous for this blog or I'd totally start that!

Hey I don't know if you have a YouTube account...

2009-12-21T11:29:19.856-07:00

Hey I don't know if you have a YouTube account or not, but when I was active on YouTube, me and a bunch of other atheists did this thing called the Blasphemy Challenge (www.blasphemychallenge.com) and we got on camera and denied the holy spirit. I think something like that should be done for the pro-choice movement. We should get on cam and say "My name is _____ and if today I found out I was pregnant, I would get an abortion". I think that would be awesome. What do you think?

Aaand...I've just read one of your older posts...

2009-12-21T10:48:49.495-07:00

Aaand...I've just read one of your older posts and realised that you've already addressed what I've said. Far better than I have. *blush* Sorry about that. Just a rant on my part.

The people who do my head in are the ones who poin...

2009-12-21T10:40:39.846-07:00

The people who do my head in are the ones who point out that, say, 79% of women who have abortions in Mississippi are black, and that therefore there's some kind of pro choice conspiracy to destroy all black people.

Uh, what? Are black women suddenly less capable of making a choice than white women now? Granted, Margaret Sanger had some fucked up views on race, but the entire claim is so stupid I just want to do multiple headdesks.

On a side note, I say that if a pharmacist wants to not sell contraception, that's fine. Just don't take taxpayer money or expect me to shop there. The waiting periods and ultrasounds are beyond moronic.

Correction, 87% of counties have no abortion provider.

Gumby- Yeah, I wasn't suggesting this i...

2009-12-14T15:16:56.325-07:00

Gumby- Yeah, I wasn't suggesting this is the only reason. Of course people have kids for stupid reasons but do I think affordability and access is a factor in some of these scenarios? Yup.

Abortion is hard to access (89% of counties don't even HAVE an abortion provider) and the most desperately poor people cannot miraculously come up with hundreds of dollars in cash to pay for an abortion in a timely manner. It's not unfathomable to see that these circumstances translate to women having babies they wouldn't necessarily have choosen to have if they had money and quick, easy access to a provider.

Anyway I do think abortion and prenatal care should be covered. Not just one option but BOTH.

I personally don't have a problem with maternity leave though. That is handled on a per company basis and often it isn't even paid leave depending on where you work.

Tom Tobin- Well, cash welfare benefits are "temporary" now thanks to the Clinton Administration. Anything else in regard to keeping a roof over a kid's head, shoes on it's feet, and food in it's mouth, I fully support. I no fan of snot monsters but they should not have to suffer in squalor under any circumstances.

As far as taxes funding abortions, I'd be more...

2009-12-14T14:39:43.840-07:00

As far as taxes funding abortions, I'd be more than happy with that if we're going to keep on funding welfare anyway; it makes way more economic sense, particularly in light of the inverse abortion-crime link. (I'd prefer we stopped funding welfare altogether, but I don't have any delusions about the situation changing anytime soon.)

"It really troubles me that a lot of poor wom...

2009-12-14T08:33:43.391-07:00

"It really troubles me that a lot of poor women can't accumulate the funds to pay for an abortion, while the government (and yes our tax money) does nothing to help."

Unfortunately that isn't always the reason for these women having (more) kids. There is also the misguided notions I have heard many times of wanting someone to loooooove me unconditionally or having another one because I'll get a bigger welfare check - misguided at best and potentially HUGE disasters.

Of course those reasons open new cans of worms relating to the whole childfree movement visibility vs. the sickening pronatalist culture, possible insufficient mental health services and the messed up public assistance programs out there.

How about we cover both prenatal care and abortion, since they are both elective, but strip away the whole maternity leave thing? If they elected to have the kid, they can figure out how to care for the damn thing and make a living once it's here! Yeah, I'm a bitch. ;)

Also, this isn't directed at anyone in particu...

2009-12-12T13:28:00.976-07:00

Also, this isn't directed at anyone in particular, I'm just being a big liberal commie as always:

It really troubles me that a lot of poor women can't accumulate the funds to pay for an abortion, while the government (and yes our tax money) does nothing to help.

If they can't afford a few hundred dollars for the abortion, how the fuck are they going to pay to raise the fucking kid?

Oh that's right...OUR TAX DOLLARS GET TO HELP HER WITH THAT.

Sorry America, the destitute woman having this kid couldn't pay for an abortion cause we don't want our tax dollars going to that.

Buuut, that means we'll have to pony up for section 8 housing assistance, a food stamp debit card worth a couple hundred dollars a month, cash benefits for a 3 years, the lunch program at school, medicaid, etc. etc. etc...

Stupid fucking logic always prevails in this goddamn country and the cycle of poverty (which is primarily a female problem- google "The Feminization of Poverty") will never end.

Even IF pregnancy isn't always elective, the c...

2009-12-12T13:07:18.158-07:00

Even IF pregnancy isn't always elective, the choice over whether or not to keep an "unelective" pregnancy is ALWAYS an elective decision. A choice HAS to be made once a pregnancy occurs right? Both choices available to pregnant women are elective. Carrying the pregnancy to term is elective. Aborting the pregnancy is elective.

I really don't think this issue is a slippery slope at all. Insurance should cover both options, not just one of them.

Also, I thought I'd add that while it would be...

2009-12-12T12:42:10.255-07:00

Also, I thought I'd add that while it would be great for the quality of society if prenatal care, birthing, and postnatal care was assumed the responsibility of the parent(s), it starts another slippery slope. While procreation is definitely a privilege in my opinion - not a right - I would hate to see become an actual luxury. At the same time, it would make me feel better knowing that people weren't bringing children into the world with little or no means to support them. While it is a shame that most people are having children and shouldn't be, it would also be a shame if most people *weren't*. The human race would suffer tremendously if only the wealthy were able to have them. There should definitely be a balance, which is why I openly promote and support the CF lifestyle. I would prefer that people who have no real interest in child-rearing not do it, and know that they have other options. So many out here are "just because" parents and it's sickening. I'm also including these morons who have babies just so they can give them those trendy, oddly-spelled names and dress them up like some kind of trophy.

What I worry about happening is unprepared parents having their child taken away from them, because they can't afford the health costs, then said child become society's responsibility. I definitely don't want that. I see what you're saying, though, about an equal playing field as far as coverage. That would be the most just option, but the bitch in me just can't stand the idea of helping people create baby science projects just because they want it. We have way too many fertile people doing that as it is. I suppose there's no real solution. We're screwed either way.

I honestly would have no problem with a system whe...

2009-12-12T10:11:01.613-07:00

I honestly would have no problem with a system where women had to fund their own prenatal care. I already despise paid maternity leave. Midwives are much cheaper than OB's and hospitals, anyway, and there would be fewer people having babies they couldn't afford. However, it is a slippery slope and I just can't make a clear all or nothing decision. I'm even torn on my last comment. I don't necessarily believe that pregnancy should take priority over other choices, but I keep in mind that pregnancy is not always "elective". I'm not thinking in terms of "Oops" babies, but rape. My concern is that non-elective pregnancies be given extra consideration. That is all.

I just can't shake the fact that I would be very uncomfortable with people having several cycles of IVF covered by government healthcare. I don't want to have start making choices for other people in that regard, but that's where I draw the line.

HawkMom- I've enjoyed your comments but...

2009-12-12T09:21:13.373-07:00

HawkMom- I've enjoyed your comments but wholeheartedly disagree with that logic.

The last time someone said to me "abortions are elective, I don't think they should be covered", I asked them "What about pregnancy??? That's ELECTIVE too ya know."

If we're not going to cover a woman's right to choose, this should relate to pregnancy too. All repro rights SHOULD be equal whether it's abortion or carrying a pregnancy to term. I'm tired of one choice being elevated above the other as if carrying to term is ALWAYS the more benevolent choice. You know, sometimes the more benevolent choice is abortion whether a woman's "physical" life is at stake or not.

So, if we're going to be responsible for all of our "elective" choices, I'll cover my $500 abortion while the wannabe moms can cover their own prenatal care as well as the searing cost of labor and delivery. What's that total up to, like $20k minimum?

Sounds fair to me.

About funding abortion, I don't think elective...

2009-12-12T01:18:47.225-07:00

About funding abortion, I don't think elective abortions should be covered, simply because I don't think fertility treatment or any reproductive assistance should be. I have to be consistent to my principles. Medically necessary ones, as in cases of ectopic pregnancy or the mother could die, of course. I would gladly donate to organizations that funded or assisted in procedures for rape victims, though. I consider those more of a priority, especially for minors. It hits close to home, which explains my partiality.*shrugs*

What? Is that family in the SF gate article Quive...

2009-12-10T19:12:24.372-07:00

What? Is that family in the SF gate article Quiverfull? Ack! No sympathy at all for them...stop breeding...

Sun Runner- That really irks me. Can you ...

2009-12-10T13:31:15.732-07:00

Sun Runner- That really irks me.

Can you IMAGINE someone saying this about pregnancy? "We really wish they wouldn't seek access to prenatal care on our dime, but we'll allow them to do so."

Fucking ignorant.

Anonymous- Yep she is my arch nemesis to the 10th power lol. And nope, no mention from these imbeciles of the babies or needy children that are already here....who cares about them! Only fetuses matter here.

Tom Tobin- I think you are correct to an extent.

You may think the people you know wouldn't have an abortion but people have a funny way of becoming pro-choice when it's THEIR womb being invaded by an unwanted fetal intruder. I've heard stories of some protesters being recognized as patients at abortion clinics...

Hypocrisy is alive & well in America...as always.

Erin- Thanks Erin!

I'm also short on sympathy after reading that story. This is my problem with these people and MOST of the people I know who live like this: They poorly plan their lives, disaster is never even contemplated much less prepared for, they are ALWAYS the architects of their own adversity because they live on hopes and dreams rather than REALITY. They have a "somehow we'll get thru" or "we'll cross that bridge when we come to it" mentality about EVERY DECISION THEY'VE EVER MADE. No one does ANY critical or long term thinking ABOUT ANYTHING.

And then when their lives are in a shambles because of their poor choices, they want empathy.

Um, NOPE.

I see these very traits in some of the people I'm closest to and it frustrates the hell out of me. I am close to ending friendships over this mentality. It's gotten that bad.

Thanks for your posts--I appreciate your honesty a...

2009-12-10T12:46:17.968-07:00

Thanks for your posts--I appreciate your honesty and directness in presenting what you've seen at PP Clinics.

This passage struck me, particularly:

'That, if they are childless and impoverished, their chances of emerging from poverty are better without the presence of children. Numerous studies (and conventional wisdom) tell us that women with children are more likely to be impoverished. One source states that "Motherhood increases the odds of poverty by an estimated 79%."'

See...just read this article in the SFGate this morning. Hello? Case in point: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/12/09/BA201B0CM5.DTL

I might be a cold, heartless bitch (and have been told I am "selfish" for not having CHILL-drenn...) but as soon as I read "Then their seventh baby was born with Down Syndrome," pretty much all my sympathy went out the fucking window. SEVEN? In the BAY AREA, and they're taking them to private schools and have no savings yada yada yada and they are looking for a bail-out. How about a donation to be used for a vasectomy, or for a tubal ligation?

Thoughts?

Oh, and those seven dwarves ... you mean Creepy, S...

2009-12-10T10:43:39.725-07:00

Oh, and those seven dwarves ... you mean Creepy, Spiteful, Sleazy, Scary, Stupid, Hateful, and Crock? :p

I feel like the pro-choice movement in America has...

2009-12-10T10:36:08.654-07:00

I feel like the pro-choice movement in America has lost. It lost when the anti-choice movement got everyone — even abortion-rights supporters — to consider abortion as shameful and tragic. Other than my wife, I know no one personally who supports abortion rights and would actually choose to have one even in the event of an unwanted pregnancy.

You got yourself an arch nemesis now? +10 coolnes...

2009-12-10T08:42:38.093-07:00

You got yourself an arch nemesis now?

+10 coolness points and a free internet.

And tell them they can stick their highchairs where the sun doesn't shine. Or ask him to sell it and use the money to, oh I don't know... help babies that ARE ALREADY HERE.

Some people are just too stupid to be alive.

I was listening to NPR yesterday morning, a segmen...

2009-12-10T06:58:31.391-07:00

I was listening to NPR yesterday morning, a segment about the ongoing argument in Congress over how abortion should or should not be funded, and some guy (of course) said this about women who would seek abortions under the new insurance regulations: "We wish they wouldn't, but we'll allow them to do so."

Uh, gee THANKS, dude. You'll "allow" me to make decisions about my own body? I feel so honored and special!

What a crock of shit.